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[23:03]<kjr>perl itself is perfectly fine (sometimes)
[23:03]<kjr>although, I don't think that adding an operator for every damn function on the planet is merrited
[23:03]<kjr>and the documentation can be... substandard
[23:03]<mjzymygo>[21:01:09] <Kog> but some languages seem to encourage bad practice
[23:03]<mjzymygo>[21:01:22] <Kog> or, for some other reason, are inhabited by programmers that do just that
[23:03]<mjzymygo>^^^ VB
[23:03]<maxgg>lol
[23:03]<mjzymygo>;P
[23:04]<maxgg>hey don't knock VB!!
[23:04]<maxgg>okay you can knock it a bit
[23:04]<maxgg>:)
[23:04]<kjr>Moridin8: I haven't read much VB, but I have issues with programming languages with high percentages of natural languages mixed in
[23:04]<kjr>causes issues - especially for people who speak that as a second language
[23:04]<kjr>or... attend the failing schools that teach that primary language
[23:04]<mjzymygo>Kog: i've messed around with repairing enough VB based projects to make that claim with some authority
[23:05]<mjzymygo>VB coders by and large suck
[23:05]<mjzymygo>individuals like Rikkus are exceptions to the rule.
[23:05]<kjr>Moridin8: well, that's because of the target audience
[23:05]<maxgg>lmao :)
[23:05]<kjr>Moridin8: the target audience aren't programmers
[23:05]<mjzymygo>kog: *lol*
[23:05]<kjr>dchen: do you begin to make sense at some point? heh
[23:05]<kjr>Moridin8: what, you gonna tell me that isn't the case?
[23:05]<mjzymygo>what is the target audience?
[23:05]<kjr>the target audience of VB, Access and most of the Office suite is non-programmers, and non-savants
[23:06]<maxgg>i am putting out fire sorry, bbl
[23:06]<mjzymygo>kog: no... just wondering about your viewpoint on your comment
[23:06]<kjr>that's well known
[23:06]<mjzymygo>hehe
[23:06]<kjr>VB was created to bring power to the people - and it did just that
[23:06]<mjzymygo>I agree
[23:06]<kjr>now, if the people are stupid, then you get stupid VB
[23:06]<kjr>which... seems to be the case
[23:06]<rxrcr>or worse, PHB VB
[23:06]<maxgg>if you know of a reference library that will do mapping of file extensions to mime types please let me know (preferrably .net)
[23:06]<kjr>so shitty VB reflects that the target audience - AKA the "average joe" - is quite stupid
[23:06]<kjr>chaka: PHP VB?
[23:06]<mjzymygo>about 95% of VB implementations I have seen have been... kack
[23:07]<rxrcr>pointy haired boss
[23:07]<kjr>Moridin8: once again, they were never intended to be great - just as perl wasn't explicitly intended to be legible
[23:07]<kjr>Moridin8: and thusly... you see the current state of affairs
[23:07]<mjzymygo>=O)
[23:07]<maxgg>batch files are pretty hard to read, shell, perl
[23:08]<maxgg>throw away scripts are hard to read
[23:08]<zgzzcygnv>hey Kog, know if virtual pc 2004 supports emulation of 64 bit cpus?
[23:08]<kjr>batch files can be hard to read, but usually aren't too bad
[23:08]<kjr>AnarkiNet: never used it
[23:08]<mjzymygo>You should see some of the VB developers I have to work with. It's hard telling them they did some real costly BAD shit and still keep them motivated
[23:08]<kjr>Moridin8: please... you ever see the stuff my boss writes? I think I pasted some
[23:08]<mjzymygo>AnarkiNet: Smellyhippy would be able to tell you
[23:08]<kjr>my primary disk is toast, or I'd send you some copies
[23:08]<mjzymygo>kog: you may have once....
[23:08]<maxgg>basically the more you expect to reuse code, extra effort is worth it, this rule applies to perl
[23:09]<maxgg>as well
[23:09]<kjr>Moridin8: for example... he doesn't understand the concept of brackets
[23:09]<zgzzcygnv>Moridin8 how about slipping them some subtle hints like after they leave work for the day, slip a "Learning C# for Beginners" book or some such on their desk :P
[23:09]<mjzymygo>kog: huh?
[23:09]<kjr>Moridin8: and he'll do stupid shit like array_push("random sql here" arrayname somethingelsefuckingrandom) { //this won't work for some reason
[23:09]<kjr>and then he won't close the bracket elsewhere
[23:09]<maxgg>if you hire someone who is using your project to learn the language for the first time--you are fucked
[23:09]<kjr>and he'll write stupid ass SQL
[23:09]<kjr>dchen: not true
[23:09]<zgzzcygnv>LOL
[23:09]<maxgg>where language is N
[23:09]<mjzymygo>Kog: you serious?
[23:09]<kjr>Moridin8: yes
[23:09]<zgzzcygnv>kog why dont you get a promotion, then i'll take your place!
[23:09]<mjzymygo>fuck
[23:10]<kjr>AnarkiNet: haha, I would if I could
[23:10]<zgzzcygnv>at least i "get" everything
[23:10]<kjr>believe me, the company would be much better off for it
[23:10]<zgzzcygnv>but i'd have to move to redmond?
[23:10]<mjzymygo>How did you get such a dill as a boss?
[23:11]<kjr>Moridin8: the sad thing is... I went to school with the guy
[23:11]<kjr>my roommate did all his homework
[23:11]<zgzzcygnv>LOL
[23:11]<kjr>this is the boss that claims that he's the ultimate SQL expert
[23:11]<mjzymygo>O.<
[23:11]<kjr>then tells me that you can't reference multiple tables in the WHERE clause without violating SQL92
[23:11]<mjzymygo>hehe... got any 300 line queries to send his way?
[23:11]<pz2>select count(clue) from boss; go
[23:11]<mjzymygo>I do if you want some
[23:11]<kjr>then he tells me that INNER JOIN is explicitly faster than LEFT JOIN
[23:11]<mjzymygo>Wtf
[23:11]<mjzymygo>is this guy for REAL?
[23:11]<zgzzcygnv>lol i have no delusions about my suckness at SQL
[23:11]<kjr>he's also the same guy that tries to use % in = clauses
[23:11]<kjr>instead of LIKE
[23:12]<kjr>and then he wonders why it doesn't work
[23:12]<kjr>Moridin8: oh, so he ran a query the other day, it destroyed the daemon... had to kill -9
[23:12]<rxrcr>tell him it doesn't work because it smells
[23:12]<vynvyv>heh
[23:12]<pz2>I have about 3 out of 10 cluepons when it comes to SQL
[23:12]<kjr>Moridin8: I spent 3 days repairing the DB
[23:12]<kjr>Moridin8: and the tables are STILL destroyed
[23:12]<kjr>because we use MyISAM
[23:12]<zgzzcygnv>ouch
[23:12]<sxdzz>argh!
[23:12]<kjr>2 gigs of data, 294 tables... all toast
[23:12]<kjr>THANKFULLY it's test data

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