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[21:53]<awjzdd>AqD: pfft whats wrong with using JS?
[21:53]<afd>jwormy: it's not eough
[21:53]<afd>it's necessary but not enough
[21:54]<afd>people want something that work completely itself
[21:54]<afd>no to add more code
[21:54]<afd>jwormy: some like paged data grid need more
[21:54]<afd>js can't take it all
[21:54]<awjzdd>yes it can
[21:54]<awjzdd>i have paged datagrids
[21:54]<afd>jwormy: paged data grid i mean:
[21:55]<afd>jwormy: it need to invoke server's methods directly
[21:55]<awjzdd>AqD: that sort when you click a header? and are paged.. show '10 items per page' yup..
[21:55]<afd>jwormy: to access the data source
[21:55]<afd>jwormy: no
[21:55]<afd>no
[21:55]<awjzdd>mine invoke the server, too
[21:55]<afd>jwormy: show me the code ;)
[21:57]<awjzdd>i use prototype for some stuff.. but actually my pagination stuff doesn't invoke the server, i dont' find that as very nessecary.
[21:57]<awjzdd>but i oculd do it if i wanted to.
[21:57]<awjzdd>with absolutly no problems.
[21:57]<afd>jwormy: but people will need manual code
[21:57]<afd>jwormy: which they dont want to :)
[21:57]<awjzdd>AqD: well fuck the lazy people... they're the one that ask all the dumb questions anyways..
[21:57]<afd>jwormy: they want to drag & drop and set the data source and finsih it all :)
[21:58]<afd>jwormy: repeated code should not exist
[21:58]<afd>that's why we need UI components
[21:58]<awjzdd>AqD: nah ui components blowwww
[21:58]<afd>jwormy: if you have a better alternative ;)
[21:58]<afd>i agree asp.net's suck
[21:58]<awjzdd>AqD: i enjoy writing valid code.. etc etc.. goodluck on having any of your pages ever validate ;)
[21:58]<afd>but no others have big component market
[21:59]<afd>jwormy: validation doesnt matter for end-users
[21:59]<awjzdd>but it does for us
[21:59]<afd>jwormy: so tell google about their gmail :D
[21:59]<afd>jwormy: it may pass, though
[22:00]<afd>since there is almost no HTML ;)
[22:00]<awjzdd>not to mention seperation of concerns is just stupid with asp.net...
[22:00]<awjzdd>since there is none.
[22:00]<afd>jwormy: it could be easily done with aqdweb
[22:00]<afd>but it's not the main concern
[22:00]<afd>as i said people dont care
[22:00]<awjzdd>AqD: you sound like a goddamn VB user.
[22:00]<afd>they want to get jobs done quickly, and full-functional, and easily
[22:00]<afd>and clean, if it can be so
[22:01]<afd>jwormy: VB user wont write aqdweb ;)
[22:01]<afd>jwormy: i copied the ideas from java web frameworks
[22:01]<awjzdd>AqD: if you don't seperate concerns then you end up with unmaintable code, which is what classical asp.net is all about
[22:01]<afd>it's separated
[22:01]<afd>jwormy: read my home page and you will see :)
[22:01]<awjzdd>AqD: oh btw, monorail can use webforsm for views..
[22:02]<afd>jwormy: yes but no real support for web forms
[22:02]<awjzdd>AqD: but i don't do it like that..
[22:02]<afd>jwormy: i know ;)
[22:02]<awjzdd>what do you mean, 'support' ?
[22:02]<frsvfd>guys, how do execute code upon successfully closing a form?
[22:02]<afd>jwormy: but it will work with ui designer
[22:02]<awjzdd>Fastly: google it.
[22:02]<afd>jwormy: monorails doc itself says
[22:02]<frsvfd>i've tried but no luck
[22:02]<frsvfd>i've found the FormClosedEventHandler Delegate
[22:03]<afd>jwormy: the lifecycles are different. It couldn't make web form any better (i doubt if they care it at all)
[22:03]<frsvfd>but no example that ties it all together
[22:03]<afd>it's whole different style
[22:03]<awjzdd>AqD: one of asp.net's faults is its complex life style..
[22:03]<frsvfd>and the Form.Closed event
[22:03]<afd>jwormy: it's not complex, it's meesy
[22:03]<afd>jwormy: they even try to workaround wrong user code
[22:03]<frsvfd>i've got the following: private void FormRefine_Closed(object sender, System.EventArgs e)
[22:03]<awjzdd>AqD: paying attention to page_load sucks.
[22:03]<afd>jwormy: read the source and you will see ;)
[22:04]<afd>jwormy: but i have to solve it
[22:04]<awjzdd>AqD: and the visual studio designer completely destroys any hand crafted html.
[22:04]<frsvfd>where would i need to make that event active?
[22:04]<afd>jwormy: agreed
[22:04]<frsvfd>because at the moment it does execute upon closing the form
[22:04]<afd>jwormy: but I have to make aqdweb working with the designer
[22:05]<awjzdd>AqD: not to mention shoving 'everything' into controls ends up killing readability and owns performance
[22:05]<afd>jwormy: aqdweb try to make things easier, not different and tell some silly vb devs to screw up (almost of them really should ;))
[22:05]<afd>jwormy: yes but performance doesn't matter
[22:05]<awjzdd>AqD: lol
[22:05]<afd>scalability is more important :)
[22:05]<rrd2uppnv>does nhibernate generate the code for the items in a database.. or does it do more than that
[22:05]<awjzdd>AqD: performance MATTERS when you are scaling things!
[22:06]<afd>jaybuffet: you have two ways
[22:06]<awjzdd>jaybuffet: AR has a generator, and there are probably ones for NHibernate as well... see 'MyGeneration'
[22:06]<afd>jaybuffet: 1.code model classes and let nhibernate do everything for you
[22:06]<afd>jaybuffet: or 2, get the tool to generate nhibernate mapping and classes from existing db
[22:06]<awjzdd>AqD: performance matters when you are worried about scalability
[22:06]<afd>jaybuffet: but most DB designs are not good and they wont work well
[22:06]<awjzdd>AqD: infact i'll go ahead and say thats the most retarded thing you've ever said.
[22:07]<afd>jwormy: raw performance doesn't matter
[22:07]<afd>jwormy: :D
[22:07]<afd>jwormy: you can have the same web page rendering in 1 msec or 2msec , it's 2x diff
[22:07]<afd>but doesn't matter most of time
[22:07]<slrgscr>How can I catch an exception thrown by XmlDocument and do something accordingly?
[22:07]<afd>IF you can have two servers to run it
[22:07]<gjrvcxnne>y0 f000000000000000000000ls!
[22:07]<[rg]sjryjlrvx>and im the troll?
[22:08]<awjzdd>AqD: and who uses two servers..
[22:08]<afd>jwormy: if it can't run on two servers, then it will soon die, even if it renders in 0.5 msec

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