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[00:00]<rrppygrvnm>endra: CVS/SVN integration? Debugging tools? How about a scriptable interface?
[00:00]<ggmzr>this is php
[00:00]<ggmzr>what you need all that for
[00:00]<z0wjz>vim has all of the above?
[00:00]<mzzcpzvn_>no this is ##php
[00:00]<rrppygrvnm>endra: are you serious?
[00:00]<z0wjz>endra, omg... wow...
[00:00]<ggmzr>it has ftp synchronization, inheritence of classes into intellisence, a very good scriptable interface
[00:00]<rrppygrvnm>r0xoR: vim has none of those, with the exception of the scriptable interface.
[00:00]<wjlllrws>em...
[00:01]<dzzznzdjusn>PHP newbie programmers need all the debugging help they can get :-)
[00:01]<z0wjz>caffinated, hehehe... ummm
[00:01]<z0wjz>caffinated, bullshit?
[00:01]<rrppygrvnm>endra: ftp? ew.
[00:01]<z0wjz>caffinated, it has all of those as plugins
[00:01]<rrppygrvnm>r0xoR: and they all suck
[00:01]<ggmzr>the only debugging for php that you need is to open your browser and see if it shows errors..
[00:01]<z0wjz>caffinated, uhhhh, hmm... for you... because I use all three to great effect
[00:01]<rrppygrvnm>r0xoR: if i wanted to step back in to an interface designed for terminals in 1984, i'd use emacs.
[00:01]<z0wjz>caffinated, what editor... oops no... sorry you don't like editors... what do you use?
[00:01]<yvzn2rf>r0xoR: btw, i dropped vim.. didn't like it
[00:02]<znzfdnzw>endra: depends what you do with php :)
[00:02]<z0wjz>wow
[00:02]<tjufgg>Why does it seem that every 6 hours another editor debate flares up?
[00:02]<z0wjz>caffinated, gvim is hardly antiquated
[00:02]<z0wjz>Touqen, i know
[00:02]<rrppygrvnm>r0xoR: it's based on vi, which is.
[00:02]<yvzn2rf>Touqen: because of somebody starting iwth r and ending with R
[00:02]<z0wjz>caffinated, based on... and significantly different from
[00:02]<wjlllrws>I used to use emacs.... I decided they;re better editors
[00:02]<dzzznzdjusn>Touqen: It's IRC..
[00:02]<ggmzr>Touqen maybe you're stuck in time dialation
[00:02]<rrppygrvnm>r0xoR: it was for a day when you had to log in to a mainframe to edit your code.
[00:03]<z0wjz>caffinated, no... that argument is totally crap... gvim 7.0 isn't much of anything like vi for mainframes in 1984
[00:03]<z0wjz>so, whatever
[00:03]<rrppygrvnm>r0xoR: now it's some sort of geek status symbol.
[00:03]<mzzcpzvn_>like emacs
[00:03]<rrppygrvnm>r0xoR: 'based on'
[00:03]<z0wjz>caffinated, meh, or maybe it's just productivity... maybe you're just angry
[00:03]<mzzcpzvn_>and look how that turned out!
[00:03]<znzfdnzw>endra: debugger can be quite handy for example when doing multipass processing on web page, for example xslt :)
[00:03]<z0wjz>caffinated, dude, your argument has no weight
[00:03]<bxnrd>SO
[00:03]<rrppygrvnm>r0xoR: i'm not angry at all, and vim doesn't really make people more productive.
[00:03]<yvzn2rf>Bheam: no use
[00:04]<rrppygrvnm>r0xoR: nor does yours.
[00:04]<z0wjz>caffinated, the two most classic arguments against vim: hard to use: old... gvim is neither
[00:04]<bxnrd>:(
[00:04]<dycnzn>caffinated: so what do you prefer to use as a dev tool for php? I'm always interested in looking at new tools
[00:04]<z0wjz>caffinated, uhhh ok so then why don't we both shut up?
[00:04]<rrppygrvnm>r0xoR: the model it's based on is though
[00:04]<suv9w9>I'm looking for a mass mailing solution for PHP for sending out newsletters. I found PHPMailer but I don't see how it helps with massive amounts of e-mails. How could I spread the load?
[00:04]<rrppygrvnm>r0xoR: yes, please do.
[00:04]<z0wjz>caffinated, whatever... what's your model?
[00:04]<z0wjz>caffinated, you still have yet to show me *YOUR* personal "uber editor"
[00:04]<bxnrd>pikachu!
[00:04]<sjlldrg>hi @ all
[00:04]<znzfdnzw>hmm any decent editor that you know well how to (mis)use can increase your productivity
[00:04]<sjlldrg>can anyone recommend a good gallery system?
[00:04]<z0wjz>caffinated, which you can be so much more productive than vim with
[00:04]<rrppygrvnm>r0xoR: it's not relevent. we're talking about vim.
[00:04]<z0wjz>caffinated, hahaha omg
[00:05]<mzzcpzvn_>soppman:gallery2 or minigal
[00:05]<z0wjz>caffinated, red herring
[00:05]<rrppygrvnm>r0xoR: +q
[00:05]<bxnrd>any php devs here? :p
[00:05]<wjlllrws>I like vim, and I wouldn't replace it with any other console editor... I think very little of joe and those alike
[00:05]<yvzn2rf>Bheam: as in writers of PHP?
[00:05]<z0wjz>Wolfpaws, thankyou
[00:05]<bxnrd>itrebal: as in, yes
[00:05]<dycnzn>caffinated: sorry, but if you have no alternative, I have a hard time accepting your criticism of r0xoR's choice.
[00:06]<z0wjz>mikere, this is exactly what I'm saying
[00:06]<rrppygrvnm>vim is great if you have to SSH in to something. I'll agree there are few console editors which are quite as powerful. but i sure as hell would not use it if I was working on a desktop.
[00:06]<z0wjz>caffinated, so what would you use?
[00:06]<z0wjz>caffinated, or what *do* you use
[00:06]<wjlllrws>I'd use kwrite
[00:06]<z0wjz>caffinated, you still haven't answered that
[00:06]<rrppygrvnm>mikere: I do, but i don't see what it has to do with vim's failings.
[00:07]<tjufgg>Someone should really ban r0xoR so that we can move on.
[00:07]<rrppygrvnm>r0xoR: and I told you it wasn't relevant
[00:07]<z0wjz>omg
[00:07]<yvzn2rf>Touqen++
[00:07]<rrppygrvnm>heh
[00:07]<wjlllrws>\o/
[00:07]<cslrd>anyone know a good PHP based bug-tracking system?
[00:07]<dycnzn>caffinated: I'm interested in looking at other dev environments and curious what you use
[00:07]<znyp>bugs.php.net :P
[00:07]<txnjzd>kspam: there's mantis
[00:07]<bxnrd>ha ha
[00:07]<rrppygrvnm>mikere: eclipse mostly.
[00:07]<znyp>phpMyBugs or something is also.
[00:07]<mnvrfbfrmn>Are there any pages which demonstrates eAccelerator (not just the installation and configuration) that you know of? I have tried my very best on google, but I haven't found anything...
[00:07]<wjlllrws>kspam: yup... Check out mantis or flyspray
[00:08]<yvzn2rf>hehehe
[00:08]<cslrd>thanks guys
[00:08]<bxnrd>so
[00:08]<dycnzn>caffinated: ah, yah, I use it a lot for java - haven't looked for php module for it yet tho
[00:08]<znzfdnzw>for example features like incremental search, completion and split screen are definetely making me more productive
[00:08]<wjlllrws>I don't think he uses much for PHP :)
[00:09]<rrppygrvnm>mikere: the php module is ok. mostly i use it for the tight svn/cvs support, and the host of other features.

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